I feel like someone has had to suggest this already, because it’s such a simple thing that’s missing, or maybe I missed it in the settings
There needs to be a voice, popup or an automatic option for recipes to alert you of status changes. I.e. when you change a roast to from roast to cook mode, and then use that roast as a recipe, it should also alert you to the change. I just did a few roasts, and I was waiting for this notification, but it just keeps going.
Or…is that what playback is supposed to do?
Playback should include an option to playback a roast from a certain point, i.e. playback from charge, or yellowing point or first crack.
You should also be able to align the playback via these checkpoints as well.
I know a lot of these are artisan features, but they’re good features that a lot of us miss since we’re kind of forced to use RoasTime (which is still a very nice software. It just needs some fine tuning)
Or we need easy artisan integration with an Aillio helper app specifically for logging and alerts.
You can add notifications to your recipes that will pop-up on the screen.
You can see the list of changes while roasting in recipe mode by pressing the “i” icon on the right, then choosing the recipe tab.
The recipe and playback only starts running when you add the beans and it goes into roast mode.
In both recipe and playback mode you can at any time change the values. These will then be overwritten the next time there is a change from the recipe / playback.
So, the alignment is always on the start of the roast. I don’t understand why someone would need to align only after yellowing or first crack? Perhaps you can shed some light on this.
Artisan has a couple of “playback” modes - one where they just pop up “change fan now” but the software doesn’t actually do it for you. The other where the computer moves the sliders too…
One change I would like to see supported is “change by time or temperature”
Right now I’m using playback, so I see that a lot of what I thought recipe was, is actually playback. But it would be ideal to be able to line up playback by yellow point or first crack for example.
That way if I go from a 1kg batch to a 500g batch I can line the graph up when I hit first crack.
Also, is there a RoasTime Manual? I searched all over and couldnt find one.
But the moral is, I understand that RoasTime ISN’T Artisan, but there’s a lot in Artisan that RoasTime would benefit from especially since I’d say probably 50% of R1 users have transitioned from an Artisan device.
And I think many would chose Artisan over RoasTime if it weren’t for the small bit of integration that RoasTime has with the Bullet.
I understand that RoasTime is trying to be the iPhone/OSX of Roast Software where as Artisan is Linux.
Maybe a Beginner/Advance/Expert mode in RoasTime would be more ideal. That way it isn’t scary for new roasters, but as your progress to wanting more, those settings can be available to you.
Just my thoughts.
I really appreciate you guys being in the forums and hearing us out vs. other products where they jump down your throat because they know best. It’s very much appreciated.
I’m pretty sure people have managed to get Artisan to talk to the Bullet (but maybe only with a specific set of drivers?) Artisan 2.x and Bullet r1v2?
'cause, seems to me, people that want to use Artisan should just use Artisan it’s such a specific piece of software, I don’t think RT will ever be a 1:1 feature replacement.
(I don’t use Artisan myself, and haven’t tried with the Bullet, so I only know what I seen in these forums. Might not know what I’m talking about )
When we designed the R1 we had a look at Artisan to see if we could get away with using this. However, we could not figure out how it worked. It was so complicated…just setting it up and figuring out what to do was messy and not intuitive. So, we decided to make our own.
In RoasTime you connect your computer and when you roast it records. No setup required and you don’t need to click a single button to record a profile.
Since that time (5 years ago) Artisan might have gotten better, but I still think it is messy and not for newcomers. Most of our customers have never roasted using a computer before so for them RT is much more user friendly.
If you have been using Artisan for many years then sure you know how to use it but it is so far away from the user experience that we want to give that we will continue with our RT RW platform.
That being said, we have most of the important features that Artisan has, and more are being added every month. Next release will be a complete overhaul visually and on the back-end.
If we keep hearing about missing features then we will add them to RT. So don’t hold back, keep all the good ideas coming.
@jacob If you’re planning such a big overall please don’t force the update on us until it is stable and please label it RT 4.x or something. Right now 3.1.9 is stable and I’d like to stick with that for the time being. Matthew knows I “complain” about this kind of “forced update” all the time It just bothers me that when I plan a roasting session where I plan to do 3 to 5 batches and I end up wasting time troubleshooting.
FWIW RT 3.1.9 right now works well (for me) and I am not even using all the features like overlay, recipes or playback because I’m probably that oddball who plans out a roast on a piece of paper based on my previous roasts. When I change what settings (e.g. F or P changes) are based on events (e.g. when YP and FC happens and maybe a time after the event), not necessarily on a time alone (except for the first 1 or 2 mins) because each bean (processing type, density) and my external environment is going to be different each time. Maybe I’m missing something but I just don’t see how RT recipes, for example, can be event driven. This is probably a separate topic all together…
@jacob I entirely get where you are coming from with respect to Artisan. It’s not a good new user experience so I can understand why you wanted to Macify a Linux experience. Artisan has a huge number of bells and whistles under the configuration and if you know how to make it jump through hoops then I’m sure it all makes sense. I think documentation was some way behind although they have made some strides on making it more readable to those who didn’t write the code. That’s alway a problem when the developers document their baby.
I personally did switch to Artisan for a period as there were some “simple” functions missing that RT didn’t have at the time - notably the prediction of YP/FC based on extrapolation of the curve. I wasn’t too bothered about IBTS RoR once I saw how jumpy it was in Artisan which at the time was able to chart it.
That said, Matthew has made some great improvements adding features to the point where I don’t need Artisan any longer because I don’t feel I am missing anything. Or at least anything I have been able to find. I think a key differentiator is Matthew is now doing some development work having experiened the roasting side - many developers work on software they never actually use so they have “their” thinking on how it should work. So kudos to you guys there - Artisan have I think a lot of theoretical experience in wrangling curves and derivatives but I’m pretty sure few of them are active hands on roasters.
I also mentioned to Matthew I had seen Cropster touting their “AI” approach to curve monitoring and prediction - we both agreed that AI is a buzzword darling that is heavily abused by gets people’s attention. Does it mean throw a bunch of beans in the machine, press GO and let the AI do the work ? No, not really. But maybe the Artisan Profile Designer could be something to look at - generate the kind of RoR curve you are looking for to cover key milestones like YP/FC DEV % etc and RT would try and keep a fan heat combo steered to meet those goals. I don’t pretend it would be easy - RT would have to know how quickly the Bullet responds to say a step up in 1P for a given bean mass (like you smart thermostat is supposed to know how early to turn on the AC in your home so it’s at your preferred temperature when you come home in two hours ).
Ergh - sorry for rambling; I wanted to tell you personally that I have always aimed for constructive criticism and suggestions rather than just “this is crappy software full of bugs” as I know some FB posts have commented. Thank you Aillio team one and all for looking beyond “hey we sold you a machine, thanks and all but we’re busy…”
Not familiar with Artisan at all so can’t comment. What if this idea is simplified. Here’s what I do when I plan a roast profile on paper, and my scribbles will look something like this:
401F PH / D8 / F2 / P7 ← this is my starting parameters and the settings when I charge the beans
P8 / F2 @ 1 min ← i.e. change to P8 / F2 @ 1 min after charge
P7 / F2 ~1 min after YP
P6 / F3 ~2 mins after YP
P6 / F4 ~1/2 to 1 min after FC
P6 / F5 ~1-1/2 to 2 min after FC
drop @ start of SC
If input parameters like that can be entered in and the software adjusts P-F-D based on when I mark YP, FC and SC I think this could be possible for RT to do without overly complicating the code base. Basically I’m entering the triggering events (when charged, YP, FC, and SC) manually while the software could adjust the settings based on those trigger events. Personally I’m not as hung up about what the RoR curve looks like, I don’t make an attempt to try to minutely control it.
I’m sure there are multiple ways to do this Just my 2 cents.
After thinking about it, maybe an initial pass would be to allow you to “design” an RoR curve based on some targets like YP/FC etc which then could be loaded as an overlay for you to try and steer along…
@stuartmcknight I think there is something like this already in RT. If you go into settings and select “Roast config”, expand the “Prediction” option and enable the “Phases”. There you can define temp targets for up to 3 “phases” however you want to define your phases. I believe it will then place colored dots on your graph during the roast session. I’ve not used it but maybe that’s what you’re looking for?
Some of this you can already do, you can trigger changes based on time (from charge) and you can trigger changes when a temp is reached, but having triggers based off YP, FC start is a cool Idea. Then it becomes kind of a dynamic recipe based on user inputs.
I will add this as a card for us to discuss if we can implement.
Regarding the update we have been testing for a long time and will not release it until we feel it is bug free. The naming will still be 3.x.x as it is backward compatible - there are some rules for how and when you increment numbers.
And if you want to try it out before it is released let us know and we will send you the latest build
No, I was the one who asked for that feature carry over from Artisan. The Profile Designer is a little different as it generates a theoretical RoR to achieve your goal…
it’s such a specific piece of software, I don’t think RT will ever be a 1:1 feature replacement.
)
It just bothers me that when I plan a roasting session where I plan to do 3 to 5 batches and I end up wasting time troubleshooting.